tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post7782531204208596246..comments2023-07-07T04:02:25.375-04:00Comments on Sane Political Discourse: Disenfranchisement and the Lobotomy VotePatrick Mhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16377933168305160179noreply@blogger.comBlogger31125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-281478290075555832008-10-24T10:54:00.000-04:002008-10-24T10:54:00.000-04:00We agree only that the government did not force th...We agree only that the government did not force the companies to get into the subprimes, but that's all. This was not a result of the rampant deregulation you claim it was. <A HREF="http://www.heritage.org/Research/Economy/wm2109.cfm" REL="nofollow">Here's a little more info on that from Heritage.org</A>.Patrick Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16377933168305160179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-90257617742813114312008-10-24T10:24:00.000-04:002008-10-24T10:24:00.000-04:00Ok, that's all I wanted to hear you say. No one wa...Ok, that's all I wanted to hear you say. No one was forced to give loans to the homeless and no one was forced to buy those loans from mortgage companies. Too much deregulation allowed this to happen. We can finally agree on something. And I do blame Clinton for signing Gramms bills into law.Toad734https://www.blogger.com/profile/01450263690181812924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-21468361007701847152008-10-23T13:29:00.000-04:002008-10-23T13:29:00.000-04:00Toad: The problem begins with the Community Reinve...Toad: The problem begins with the Community Reinvestment Act, which was changed in 1995, 1992, and 2002, under presidents Clinton and Bush, and (irony here) the Republican Congress. This created an environment where the subprime market could thrive.<BR/><BR/>Now no company was forced to do anything. But like any time the government meddles in a market rather than some commonsense regulation, it creates imbalance that companies will naturally exploit. And if it coincides with a bubble (the housing bubble in this case), it's going to do damage.Patrick Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16377933168305160179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-59337301699354476852008-10-23T13:18:00.000-04:002008-10-23T13:18:00.000-04:00Of course there are many factors at work here and ...Of course there are many factors at work here and yes they started a bit before Bush. They started when McCains former economic advisor, Phil Gramm, wrote two bills which deregulated the insurance, banking and energy sector. One led to Enron, the other led to AIG. Was a guy at Fannie part of the problem, sure but it all comes back to the Republican policy of deregulation. Well, that and greed and the free market.<BR/><BR/>The problem is that people, like you and Mike, who get their news from Rush Limbaugh is that you think this is all Freddie and Fannies fault, that they were forced to give homeless people loans, banks and investment firms were forced to buy those loans, and Obama got more money from those guys than McCain. None of which are true.Toad734https://www.blogger.com/profile/01450263690181812924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-79796450927077208512008-10-23T13:04:00.000-04:002008-10-23T13:04:00.000-04:00Toad: This big of a collapse has been coming for ...Toad: This big of a collapse has been coming for a lot longer that Bush has been in office. Now while you'd love to lay all the blame on one man, you know there's a whole lot of blame to go around on this one. But I think we've covered this ground already.Patrick Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16377933168305160179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-73287852962457830632008-10-23T11:48:00.000-04:002008-10-23T11:48:00.000-04:00I didn't vote for Bush, that was you. So do we hav...I didn't vote for Bush, that was you. So do we have you to thank for this mess? Everybody here thank Mike for the 20% reduction in your 401k. If it weren't for excessive Republican deregulation and an incompetent President we wouldn't be in the mess.Toad734https://www.blogger.com/profile/01450263690181812924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-50648675774877968182008-10-23T11:13:00.000-04:002008-10-23T11:13:00.000-04:00Toadbat said:"As far as retards...well, Bush got e...Toadbat said:<I>"As far as retards...well, Bush got elected twice so I am all for banning them.<BR/>"</I><BR/><BR/>I agree... Toadbat shouldn't be allowed to vote!Mike's Americahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01262938295909490454noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-29991379859470712082008-10-23T10:47:00.000-04:002008-10-23T10:47:00.000-04:00Saty: "Release the hounds!"I could take that and ...Saty: <I>"Release the hounds!"</I><BR/><BR/>I could take that and come up with something really mean. But I'll be nice and stay with the girl vid imagery from above.<BR/><BR/>BTW, what do you say when you and Shaw line up with <B>ME</B> on an issue (it is a possibility)?Patrick Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16377933168305160179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-56532772282917919452008-10-23T07:58:00.000-04:002008-10-23T07:58:00.000-04:00There's only one thing you can say when me and Sha...There's only one thing you can say when me and Shaw line up on an issue, Patrick: <BR/><BR/><B>"Release the hounds!"</B>Satyavati devi dasihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13980257934310271457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-41006993892219680782008-10-23T01:16:00.000-04:002008-10-23T01:16:00.000-04:00I'm to tired to argue either way. I'll let you la...I'm to tired to argue either way. I'll let you ladies fight this one out.<BR/><BR/>The quote comes from the movie <A HREF="http://www.viewaskew.com//main.html" REL="nofollow">>Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back</A>, proving I am so Kevin Smith's bitch.Patrick Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16377933168305160179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-40164653527189673152008-10-22T21:47:00.000-04:002008-10-22T21:47:00.000-04:00So the people that have been shoved cigarette's in...<I>So the people that have been shoved cigarette's in their hand and told to vote 76 (don't quote me on that number, but it's close) times, are all false?</I><BR/><BR/>Jennifer,<BR/><BR/>Where's the link that has federal officials claiming voter FRAUD has been committed?<BR/><BR/>I'd like to read the evidence.Shaw Kenawehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08637273000409613497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-35408240108665182742008-10-22T18:49:00.000-04:002008-10-22T18:49:00.000-04:00How does registering voters, true or false, help e...How does registering voters, true or false, help either candidate if they aren't voting?<BR/><BR/>That's like saying buying Bandaids will help your boo-boo get better even if you don't use them.Satyavati devi dasihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13980257934310271457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-6089678392982822432008-10-22T18:37:00.000-04:002008-10-22T18:37:00.000-04:00Jennifer said... "Maybe I'll give you a break, whe...Jennifer said... "Maybe I'll give you a break, when you convince me Acorn isn't conducting fraud."<BR/><BR/>Don't hold your breath Jennifer.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-88237858037011882432008-10-22T18:26:00.000-04:002008-10-22T18:26:00.000-04:00FRAUD......the definition....."In the broadest sen...FRAUD......the definition.....<BR/><BR/>"In the broadest sense, a fraud is a deception made for personal gain or to damage another individual."<BR/><BR/>Acorn deceptively registered false names to hurt John McCain and help Obama.<BR/><BR/>Maybe I'll give you a break, when you convince me Acorn isn't conducting fraud.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-7884343875770629992008-10-22T17:48:00.000-04:002008-10-22T17:48:00.000-04:00Saty: This is scary, we keep defending each other....<I>Saty: This is scary, we keep defending each other.</I><BR/><BR/>That's cause we're secretly in love...but our political principles will forever keep us apart....<BR/><BR/>...It'll be one of those hideous movies on the (LMN) Abused Women Network one of these days.Satyavati devi dasihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13980257934310271457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-39202344794603675962008-10-22T17:40:00.000-04:002008-10-22T17:40:00.000-04:00The real issue with the whole ACORN thing is that ...The real issue with the whole ACORN thing is that people were paid per registration. They should have been paid hourly. Paying people per registration opens up the door for this kind of problem.<BR/><BR/>Again, it's not FRAUD. ACORN has to flag suspicious registrations and turn them all in regardless. There is no 'fraud' involved in silly registrations. FRAUD occurs when Mickey, Minnie, Donald and Pluto show up and want to vote.<BR/><BR/>Please, please, for the sake of your party's dignity, get this stuff right.Satyavati devi dasihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13980257934310271457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-54547814120962040822008-10-22T17:34:00.000-04:002008-10-22T17:34:00.000-04:00Being that I don't like unsubstantiated bullshit s...Being that I don't like unsubstantiated bullshit stories, I went looking for some credible information about "voting 76 times".<BR/><BR/>Here's what I found: <BR/><BR/><B>A Cleveland teenager who claims he registered to vote 73 times over a five-month period has set of alarm bells among election officials in Ohio's most populous county.</B><BR/><BR/>To avoid a link war, you can find this article at nbc10.com.<BR/><BR/>OK. There is a world of distinction between a teenager CLAIMING that he registered to vote 73 times and someone actually VOTING 73 times.<BR/><BR/>You can register God to vote if you want, but it's still not FRAUD until someone shows up claiming to be The Holy Trinity and wanting to hit the ballot box.<BR/><BR/>Like I said earlier.. people are much more likely to believe a mistruth if it fits in with their preconceptions.<BR/><BR/>You'll have to come up with some better research. This is on a par with the 'vetting' done on Caribou Barbie.. look at all the mildew they left under that rug to be found.<BR/><BR/>Meanwhile, give me a break, will you?Satyavati devi dasihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13980257934310271457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-53566413363351165932008-10-22T15:35:00.000-04:002008-10-22T15:35:00.000-04:00"The wild charges made against ACORN aren't true. ..."The wild charges made against ACORN aren't true. Period."<BR/><BR/>I am trying to imagine you saying this with a straight face...but I just can't, it's too difficult. With so much evidence amounting, how can you possibly say that ACORN is not committing fraud? So the people that have been shoved cigarette's in their hand and told to vote 76 (don't quote me on that number, but it's close) times, are all false? They just decided to make it up to help McCain? Pleazzzze!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-63688507363066071152008-10-22T15:07:00.000-04:002008-10-22T15:07:00.000-04:00"Oh, what a lovely tea party." Hmmmm, I'd guess "..."Oh, what a lovely tea party." <BR/><BR/>Hmmmm, I'd guess "Alice in Wonderland," but I don't think so, since I actually played Alice in a school production of "The Mad Tea Party." I don't remember that line, and we took the dialog right out of Lewis Carroll's story.<BR/><BR/>So, ding, ding. You win.Shaw Kenawehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08637273000409613497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-31627428150486742572008-10-22T15:02:00.000-04:002008-10-22T15:02:00.000-04:00Obob: That's something I forgot to bring up (as I...Obob: That's something I forgot to bring up (as I fell asleep while typing the post). If you can't get around to getting the ID required to vote (even if it's free), then you don't deserve to vote for being a lazy bastard.<BR/><BR/>Shaw: That's why I said the list was neither complete or accurate. But when an organization, in city after city has the same problems popping up, it raises suspicions at the very least. <BR/><BR/>Now as for any attempt to disqualify voters because of address and foreclosure issues falls into the bad category, as does threatening the dolts who didn't take care of their traffic tickets.<BR/><BR/>Denver, on the other hand, is what happens when you have a half-asses system (probably imported from Cleveland).<BR/><BR/>Mary: <I>Is this place a communist den?</I><BR/><BR/>No, but it is a place where people of seriously diverging opinions gather and spar with each other. Consequently, it's more interesting than a site where one person with a different opinion is called an idiot by everybody else that comments. Besides, 3 liberals versus me isn't fair... to the liberals. :)<BR/><BR/>Hopefully you can add something here.<BR/><BR/>Toad: I'd comment on your insight, but you'd have to have some first. :)<BR/><BR/>Saty: This is scary, we keep defending each other.<BR/><BR/>I tried to be fair in my assessment, and I knew I'd hear about all the crap I missed. Hopefully, they broke out the backup paper ballots in that particular place.<BR/><BR/>As for bloviating, got that one from Bill O'Reilly. As for the quote, it took some searching, but the answer is <I>Get Shorty</I>. Haven't seen it.<BR/><BR/>Shaw, Mary: Come on now. Kiss and make up. And send me the video. And at the end, when you're done, say "Oh, what a lovely tea party."<BR/><BR/>Bonus points if you can guess which movie I got that quote from.Patrick Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16377933168305160179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-54947169307406169972008-10-22T14:05:00.000-04:002008-10-22T14:05:00.000-04:00Just SLUMMING my dear Shaw Kenawe .Kind of like go...Just SLUMMING my dear Shaw Kenawe .<BR/>Kind of like going to the Zoo.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-76006533265808177962008-10-22T14:00:00.000-04:002008-10-22T14:00:00.000-04:00Mary Mary Quite Contrary said... Is this place a c...<I>Mary Mary Quite Contrary said... <BR/><BR/><BR/>Is this place a communist den?<BR/>Or just a place for a bunch of brain-washed morons to gather?</I><BR/><BR/>Well, you've "gathered" here, my dear, you tell us.Shaw Kenawehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08637273000409613497noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-83474433633306053112008-10-22T13:55:00.000-04:002008-10-22T13:55:00.000-04:00In either WV or Va, can't remember which, early vo...In either WV or Va, can't remember which, early voters were upset with voting machines and reported that even when they were pressing the 'Obama' and/or 'Democrat' buttons, the machine kept switching over to 'McCain' and/or 'Republican'.<BR/><BR/>Many people went away unhappy and unsure that their intended vote was put in the system as intended.<BR/><BR/>Mary: Please. I'm a socialist, not a communist, and this is not a den of either. Patrick happens to be a rarity of his (conservative) breed, both open minded and intelligent. He encourages discussion and debate from both sides of the fence with the result that (omg!) both sides often come away learning something. If you can't deal with that, I can give you links to small-minded and xenophobig blogs where you might feel more at home.<BR/><BR/>And yes. The ACORN thing is being blown way, way out of proportion. Voter FRAUD does not happen until someone tries to VOTE as Mickey Mouse. REGISTERING Mickey Mouse to vote is not the same as Mickey attempting to put in his squeaky little two cents. Of course, most people don't know this, so it's easy to convince them some evil leftist plot is in place that, of course, involves some kind of fraud. It's easy to get people to believe mistruths they want to believe. So please, get over it, get past it, get on with it.<BR/><BR/>Patrick: Bloviating is a fabulous word and I'm going to keep it.<BR/><BR/>(and gratuitous movie quote time) "I like you.. I think you're a decent kind of man, even if you are a crook."<BR/><BR/>Bonus points if you get the movie right.Satyavati devi dasihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13980257934310271457noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-45641252700910106192008-10-22T13:05:00.001-04:002008-10-22T13:05:00.001-04:00ANd don't you have to have an address to vote? In ...ANd don't you have to have an address to vote? In Chicago you do...of course that address can be a cemetary.Toad734https://www.blogger.com/profile/01450263690181812924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1250195226200160668.post-53941126767752070332008-10-22T13:05:00.000-04:002008-10-22T13:05:00.000-04:00Im pretty sure Felons and illegals are already on ...Im pretty sure Felons and illegals are already on that list.<BR/><BR/>As far as retards...well, Bush got elected twice so I am all for banning them.Toad734https://www.blogger.com/profile/01450263690181812924noreply@blogger.com